Beyond The Surface.

Beyond The Surface.

Religious trauma is real. Cults go well beyond fringe groups. And it’s long past time we talked about both.

After 2.5 years and 133 episodes, Beyond the Surface has wrapped up. Every episode is still available to listen to, wherever you get your podcasts.

What you can hear us talk about

What it’s actually like to leave a church, religion or cult that shaped your whole life

How controlling, shame-based belief systems keep affecting you long after you leave

The confusion, grief, anger and relief that come with deconstructing your faith

Conversations with people who have left cults and high-control groups and built new lives

Queerness, sexuality, desire and finding where you belong after religion

Start here

133 episodes is a lot. If you’re not sure where to begin, try one of my top 3 episode.

Promotional poster for a podcast titled 'Beyond the Surface' featuring photos of a woman with dark hair and glasses in a red cardigan and a man with a beard outdoors. The podcast discusses life after leaving faith and losing community, with hosts Sam Sellers and Matt Glover.
Promotion for a talk titled 'Beyond the Surface: The One Who Found The Divine In The Forest with Jess Manusama' with Sam Sellers, featuring a photo of Jess Manusama, a woman with curly dark hair smiling, on a beige and white background.
Promotional flyer for a talk titled 'beyond the surface' with Sam Sellers, discussing how religion influences recognition of abuse. Contains a photo of a smiling woman with dark hair, glasses, and a white shirt, with text and branding for Anchored Counseling Services.

Some of our wonderful guests

  • Close-up of Elise Heerde a smiling woman with long brown hair wearing clear glasses, with green plant leaves blurred in the background.

    Elise Heerde

  • Portrait of David Hayward with white hair and a beard, wearing glasses and a white shirt, sitting with arms crossed against a plain white background.

    David Hayward

  • Nikki G - A woman with curly black hair sitting against a plain white background, smiling with her head resting on her hand, wearing a light pink blazer and a white blouse with black polka dots.

    Nikki G

  • Mike Maeshiro - A young man smiling outdoors near a railing with a blurred background of sky and buildings.

    Mike Maeshiro

  • Ashley Buckner - A woman with blonde, wavy hair smiling and wearing a black blazer over a black top, standing against a plain light background.

    Ashley Buckner

  • Lucas Wilson - A man with curly brown hair and a beard, wearing a pink button-up shirt, sitting outdoors with a wooden door and green plants in the background.

    Lucas Wilson

  • Micki McAllen - A woman with bright pink hair and black sunglasses on her head, smiling in a colorful setting with a brick wall and cake displays in the background.

    Micki McAllen

  • R Scott Okomoto- A smiling man wearing glasses and a black shirt, posed against a dark background.

    R Scott Okomoto

  • Sammy - Haram Doodles - Close-up of woman with curly hair, smiling, in a restaurant with brick wall and glass window in background.

    Sammy (Haram Doodles)

  • Kit Morgan - A smiling person with short hair, wearing large orange glasses and a blue denim shirt, sitting at a table with their arm resting on the surface. They have tattoos on their forearm and are looking down, with a plain white wall.

    Kit Morgan

  • Minister Marge - A person with colorful, styled pink and yellow hair, wearing vibrant makeup, bright lipstick, and a red and yellow feathered costume with jewelry.

    Minister Marge

  • Elodie Hart - A woman with long brown hair and blue eyes smiling in a well-lit room.

    Sara Madderson (Elodie Hart)

  • Colby Martin - A smiling man with styled dark hair, a trimmed beard, wearing a denim jacket over a striped shirt, posing against a plain light gray background.

    Colby Martin

  • Gillie Jenkinson - An elderly woman with short white hair and glasses smiling in front of a bookshelf filled with books.

    Gillie Jenkinson

Listen To The Podcast Here
Sam Sellers - A woman with glasses, a nose ring, and earrings smiling outdoors, wearing a yellow floral shirt.

A note from Sam

I started Beyond the Surface because religious harm wasn’t being talked about honestly, and the people living with it deserved better. Over 133 episodes, we gave grief and anger room without minimising either. We talked about how leaving religion and high-control groups affects your body, your relationships and your sense of who you are, as well as what you believe.

Thank you to every guest who shared their story, and to everyone who listened, messaged and shared an episode with someone who needed it. The conversation isn’t over. It’s just moved.